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But react is a library... not a framework...

kevin reeevers It's still a train wreck of string processing asshattery that seems catered almost entirely to satiate the wants of people who dove for JavaScript before they even knew enough HTML to be using scripting in the first damned place!

ESPECIALLY whenever that CSR asshattery gets involved, telling users with accessibility needs to go f*** themselves; in the traditional "Graceful degradation? Semantic Markup? Never heard of 'em!" way.

Eh, to each it's own. I get your point, and it's true, most use these for handicaps, but unfortunately no one ain't got time (especially business) to use raw fundamentals. So humans do what humans do... jump on hypetrains without any knowledge, and hope it all works out.

I know a thing or two about HTML, CSS, DOM scripting, accessibility etc. (which I’ve worked on since the IE6/Firefox 1 days), and still find React and Vue to be worthwhile tools.

Of course they can be used in less than stellar ways, e.g. used at all when plain HTML would be preferable or used to generate a non-semantic DOM. But that’s nothing new, as we’ve seen plenty of nightmarish HTML, CSS and vanilla JS too. It’s disingenuous to contrast competent uses of static HTML to incompetent uses of React/Vue.

I would also suggest that every time I’ve seen an awfully inaccessible result, it was because backend or “data flow” developers with no UI skills were tasked with building UI, in order to limit costs. I’ve seen plenty of ASP, Java and PHP developers producing crap HTML out of necessity (being tasked to do something you don’t master and don’t enjoy). Of course JS developers working with Angular, Vue, React or whatever (including vanilla JS) will do similarly bad.